Bible Prophecy

My Big, Fat, Greek Revived Empire: Part I

In Daniel Chapter 2, Babylonian King Nebuchadnezzar has a dream he does not understand.

None of his magicians (magi) can tell him the content or the meaning of the dream. But the God of Israel reveals the content and meaning of the dream to Daniel, a Hebrew boy captive in the king’s service.

Daniel then explains the dream to the king. The dream featured a large statue of a man.

  1. Its head was gold.
  2. Its chest and arms were silver.
  3. Its belly and thighs were bronze.
  4. Its legs were iron.
  5. Its feet were iron mixed with clay.

Daniel explained that these five body parts represented a chronological succession of empires, starting at the head of gold. Nebuchadnezzar (who had the dream) and his Babylonian Empire were that head of gold. The next empire down would be Medo-Persia. After that comes Greece. After that comes…

The whole time I’ve been a Protestant Christian, I’ve been taught that the legs on the statue represent the Roman Empire, and that the feet represent a revived Roman Empire that will be the Antichrist’s end-times beast empire. This revived Roman Empire is shown here as the “Holy Roman Empire.”

nebuchadnezzar empires man

A Failing Grade For Anatomy 101

The American church teaches this version of the statue’s anatomy as a foundational truth. In other words, it is asserted as fact– as if God himself had assigned the legs and feet to Rome. All other end times teaching in the church is then based upon Rome being the legs and feet of Nebuchadnezzar’s statue. However, even the most cursory reading of Daniel is enough to cast serious doubt on this teaching (I’m being very generous). The fact of the matter is that Daniel gives a great amount of ink not to the Roman Empire, but to the Greek Empire! God, through Daniel, is directing our end-times attention to Greece, not Rome.

When In Rome

For years I believed what Bible teachers told me about Rome being included on the statue. I simply went along with the crowd. After all, we in the Protestant church are Bible believers, and we would never allow tradition to take precedence over the Bible, right? That’s something only Catholics do, right? Wrong and wrong. Despite the fact that many Protestants assign Rome to the legs and feet on Nebuchadnezzar’s statue, God does nothing of the sort. To the contrary, God paints vivid prophetic pictures of leaders who sprang forth from the Greek Empire, not the Roman Empire. In Daniel 8, we read lengthy and painstaking detail foretelling Alexander the Great’s conquest of the Medo-Persian Empire, and the dissolution of his Greek Empire to his four generals– exactly as would happen 300 years later in perfect fulfillment of this prophecy. In Daniel 11, we read lengthy and painstaking detail foretelling the exploits of Antiochus IV Epiphanes (a foreshadowing of the Antichrist) of the Seleucid Empire. The Seleucid Empire was one of the four offshoots of the Greek Empire, not the Roman Empire. If a revived Roman Empire is the empire we need to watch out for in the end times, then why does God commit such great swaths of Scripture to the Greek Empire? Why does God not give Rome such attention? Again, it is because He is directing our end-times attention to Greece, not Rome.

Turkey Platter, Hold The Greece

But why is God directing our attention to Greece? Well, first a geography lesson is in order. The word “Grecia” (Greece) is used three times in the book of Daniel. The Hebrew word used here is “Yavan.” Look at what the word “Yavan” means:

Yavan (yaw-vawn’); effervescing (i.e. hot and active); Javan, the name of a son of Joktan, and of the race (Ionians, i.e. Greeks) descended from him, with their territory… ~ Strong’s Concordance

Note these words: “Ionians… with their territory.” Now, in which modern-day nation do we find the Biblical land of “Ionia”?

Drumroll please…

Ionia is in modern-day Turkey, not Greece.

Top: Ancient map of Asia Minor showing “Ionia” (Source: Wikipedia). Bottom: Modern map of Turkey (Source: Wikipedia). Alterations, arrow, some labels added by alwaysproventrue.com.

Ionia is in modern-day Turkey, the mother nation of the Islamic Ottoman Empire. This is the empire that comprises the legs and feet of Nebuchadnezzar’s statue.

Turkey is like a rubber ball that keeps popping up in the end-times pool no matter how much the American church tries to ignore it and push it under the surface. Acknowledging that Turkey plays the primary role in the end-times would mean that American Bible teachers, who for years have trumpeted a revived Roman Empire based in Europe as the end-times beast empire, would be wrong. These teachers have written countless books, and recorded countless CDs, DVDs, and podcasts asserting that Rome (in the form of the European Union) will be the Antichrist’s end-times beast empire. With so much time, energy, and reputation invested in the Roman paradigm, few teachers are willing to admit that they are wrong.

“A+” For Anatomy 101

In addition to Daniel pointing our end-times attention to Turkey, Jesus Christ himself points our end-times attention to Turkey by addressing all seven letters in Revelation to churches in Turkey.

  1. Ephesus
  2. Smyrna
  3. Pergamum
  4. Thyatira
  5. Sardis
  6. Philadelphia
  7. Laodicea
Modern-Day Turkey Showing Seven Churches of Revelation

The churches addressed by Jesus in the Book of Revelation are in modern-day Turkey, not Rome. (Image source: University of Texas at Austin. Historical Atlas by William Shepherd 1923-26 via Emerson Kent. Black font labeling added by alwaysproventrue.com).

In addition, Jesus Christ himself says that Satan’s throne is in Turkey, not Rome.

“To the angel of the church in Pergamum [Turkey] write: …I know where you live — where Satan has his throne. ~ Revelation 2:12-13

Just as He does in the Book of Revelation, in the Book of Daniel God is figuratively jumping up and down, waving his arms, and screaming to direct our end-times attention to Turkey, not Rome! We must reject the incorrect labeling of Nebuchadnezzar’s statue that dominates the American church. We must trust the Bible, not Protestant tradition. As such, the correct labeling of Nebuchadnezzar’s statue looks like this:

Nebuchadnezzar's Statue with Ottoman Empire

New Wineskins

Among Christians who admit Turkish end-times dominance, I notice a fascinating phenomenon. That is, not only do they reject a revived Roman Empire based in Europe, they also see that the pre-tribulation rapture is nowhere in the Bible, as do I!  I am very excited about this dual shift in theological understanding. I notice it so consistently that I cannot help suspect that God is creating for himself new wineskins specifically for the time of testing that is coming upon the whole world.

If there is anything the Bible is as clear about as end-times Turkish dominance, it is the fact that the church will go through the Great Tribulation.

The Bible is always proven true.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Who are the “people of the prince to come” in Daniel 9:26? Read about it here:

My Big, Fat, Greek Revived Empire: Part II

16 replies »

  1. You’re ignoring that great beast: the Holy Roman Catholic Church. All of his titles add up to 666. He sits on his throne claiming to be God, forgiving sins, receiving worship and all bow to him, even the jews. He persecuted the saints throughout the dark ages and even today. Turkey will play a great role but with the Catholic Church they will betray Israel. The clay and iron feet have ten toes, the western nations around Rome. They have not mixed successfully through marriage and all attempts at world domination have failed. But the Pope rules them all. All of the kings and Presidents bow to him. Even Obama went to Rome to get his blessings and his mandate: Replace Jesus with the alternate Jesus, any Pope will do.

  2. Michael,

    It’s true that I am ignoring the Holy Roman Catholic Church, because it is nowhere on the statue. The end times system of the Antichrist will deny that Jesus is the Son of God.

    Who is the liar? It is the man who denies that Jesus is the Christ. Such a man is the antichrist — he denies the Father and the Son. ~ 1 John 2:21-23

    Catholics bless themselves “in the name of the Father, and OF THE SON, and of the Holy Spirit.”

    In contrast, look at how Islam (the system of the Ottoman Turkish Empire) views the idea of God having a son:

    They say, ‘God has begotten a son.’ God forbid! Self-sufficient is He. His is all that the heavens and the earth contain. Surely for this you have no sanction. Would you say of God what you know not? – Quran 10:68

    Those who say: ‘The Lord of Mercy has begotten a son,’ preach a monstrous falsehood, at which the very heavens might crack, the earth break asunder, and the mountains crumble to dust. That they should ascribe a son to the Merciful, when it does not become the Lord of Mercy to beget one! – Quran 19:88

    Never has God begotten a son, nor is there any other god besides Him. Were this otherwise, each god would govern his own creation, each holding himself above the other. Exalted be God above their falsehoods! – Quran 23:91

    Islam matches this and all the other Biblical criteria for the Antichrist perfectly. The Catholic church does not.

    In addition, there is an Islamic Shrine and an Islamic Mosque on the Temple Mount. There is not a Catholic church on the Temple Mount.

    And I respectfully disagree with your read on how the pope is esteemed by Obama. Obama offended Catholics in Ireland when he suggested in a speech that Catholic Schools are divisive. Does Obama make such statements about Islamic Madrassahs when he gives speeches in Islamic nations? Of course not. Furthermore, Obama is closing the standalone U.S. Embassy to the Vatican in a huge symbolic slap to the face of Catholicism. Obama committed these intentional insults to disrespect the pope, not bow to him.

    Regarding persecution of the saints, no world system committed greater violence against the saints than did the Ottoman Empire (which is reviving before our eyes on the evening news). Look up the Armenian Genocide and the other massacres that occurred.

    It is always a pleasure to have these friendly debates with you. Happy New Year!

  3. Thanks for your answer, I learn much from your site. I must however restate that the legs of iron are Rome and the Beast has to come out of her. This little horn is the Vatican. Perhaps turkey is the false prophet or just part of the spirit of antichrist. The dragon stands as a symbol of Satan and Rome. The Beast is the little horn, a man, 666 or Vicarious Filii Dei. The catholic church has persecuted God’s word, removing all references to the Deity of Jesus. They’ve persecuted the Bible and Christians and Jews from their beginnings. Regardless of the evil of Islam, the beast comes out of Rome and not in some distant future but right after its fall. That’s when this beast picked up the scepter of the ceasars and sat on the throne again.(revived). And America is indeed in the Bible. It is the 2nd beast that follows the first beast, the Catholic Church. The same year that Napoleon sent the Pope into exile, ” wounded unto death”, France recognized the United States. In 1929 the Vatican was reinstated and the papers said , “the deadly wound was healed.” The beast is a man and the Pope’s titles are 666.

    • Okay sir, I’ll let that be the last word in the debate of this thread. The evidence for my point of view is on this website if anyone is interested in looking. Although I vehemently disagree with your position, I respect that you assert and defend it rather than just giving the excuse that it doesn’t really matter– which I hear far too often.

  4. I was told that, for the most part, the metal used by the Greeks was Bronze and the Romans used iron. Is this true?
    What has been the preferred metal of the Ottoman Empire?

    • Bryce,

      The swords that the Ottoman Empire used to behead more Christians than any other empire in history were iron, or steel which is derived from iron. However, I put no stock in the dominant use of this or that metal in any of these empires. The metals could represent a number of different attributes– value, rarity, malleability, hardness. On the whole, when we let the Bible interpret the Bible, we see that only one empire fits every single attribute the Bible warns us about (beheading of Christians, denial of the Trinity, abuse of women, etc.), and it is the Islamic empire.

      Thank you for taking the time to comment! God bless!

    • Bryce,

      The iron mixed with clay could be the Sunni/Shia divide, the Turkey/Egypt divide, a nephilim/human divide, or many other possibilities. A huge clue is that the Aramaic word for “mixed” is “Arab.”

      Thank you very much for the comment!

    • I believe the ten toes represent ten nations or ten groups of nations that comprise the revived Caliphate. For example, they will include Turkey, Egypt, Libya, and Northern Sudan for sure:

      Daniel 11:42-43
      He [The Antichrist, the Caliph, the leader of the revived Islamic Ottoman Turkish Empire] shall stretch out his hand against the countries, and the land of Egypt shall not escape. He shall become ruler of the treasures of gold and of silver, and all the precious things of Egypt, and the Libyans and the Cushites shall follow in his train.

      The remainder of the ten will become clear as the months and years go on. Likely, it’s Iran, Yemen, Syria, etc.

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